Movie Lull Season

[Stewball]

The writer of the Hunger Games book claims she had never heard of Battle Royale until after she finished her novel...but just about every review I've read (of the book, not the movie) has commented on the unusually high number of similarities between the two stories. Even if the similarities were just completely coincidental and Suzanne Collins is being truthful about her lack of exposure to BR, the fact remains that it's essentially the same thing. BR was full of gory violence, and HG is not. Hence, I can't see how HG will be anything to get too excited about.

Wiki:

The Hunger Games has been criticized for its similarities to the 1999 novel Battle Royale. Although Collins maintains that she "had never heard of that book until [her] book was turned in," [u]The New York Times reports that "the parallels are striking enough that Collins’s work has been savaged on the blogosphere as a baldfaced ripoff," but that "there are enough possible sources for the plot line that the two authors might well have hit on the same basic setup independently."[/b] (Stephen) King noted that the reality TV "badlands" were similar to Battle Royale, as well as The Running Man and The Long Walk. The NY Times, John Green, In a review for The New York Times, John Green wrote that the novel was "brilliantly plotted and perfectly paced", and that "the considerable strength of the novel comes in Collins's convincingly detailed world-building and her memorably complex and fascinating heroine." However, he also noted that sometimes the book does not realize the allegorical potential that the plot has to offer and that the writing "described the action and little else". He also pointed out that the premise of the novel was "nearly identical" to Battle Royale.

First of all, I need to know if the similarities are general or specific, and I won't know that, about the movie, until I've seen them. I see enough differences in the trailers to believe it isn't a serious concern, and maybe the presentation of graphic violence is even a good thing for those of us interested in more than that for ourselves and our children. No matter what you may think of it otherwise, it's in English--a bias which may blind some to the way BR ripped off Lord of the Flies as Pickpocket brilliantly pointed out.

[TheDenizen]

Yeah but surely she read Lord of the Flies which is what Battle Royale ripped off

ehhhh, I see the point you're making, but there's a lot more of a difference between LotF and BR than there is between BR and HG. Regardless, I'm not not trying to argue that HG is bad, just that it doesn't interest me because it too closely resembles a lesser version of something I've already seen.

[hellboy76]

It also sounds similar to my family reunions and Festivus gatherings but you don't see me raising a stink.

[ShogunRua]

Yeah but surely she read Lord of the Flies which is what Battle Royale ripped off

How many of the three books have you read, dude? In my case, I have read "Lord of the Flies", "Battle Royale", AND "The Hunger Games".

Trust me, BR, while possibly inspired by Lord of the Flies, is very different. Even the overarching plot descriptions are notably dissimilar. By the way, I don't have a problem with a work being inspired by another one.

"Lord of the Flies" itself was a more juvenile version of "Heart of Darkness" mixed with a more adult version of "The Coral Island". William Golding admitted as much. And that's fine. It's different enough from both of those works. Same with "Battle Royale" compared to "Lord of the Flies".

But "The Hunger Games" is just blatantly ripping off BR, to the point of having the exact same plot description and even copying many similar scenes and character details.

First of all, I need to know if the similarities are general or specific, and I won't know that, about the movie, until I've seen them. I see enough differences in the trailers to believe it isn't a serious concern, and maybe the presentation of graphic violence is even a good thing for those of us interested in more than that for ourselves and our children. No matter what you may think of it otherwise, it's in English--a bias which may blind some to the way BR ripped off Lord of the Flies as Pickpocket brilliantly pointed out.

Stew, why don't you do yourself a favor and actually read both "Lord of the Flies" and "Battle Royale"?

Then, you can come back to this discussion with actual facts and perspective, instead of vague insinuations and blind guesses.

[Spunkie]

Books are too similar to subtitles, as in both contains letters that has to be read.

[Anomaly]

Books are too similar to subtitles, as in both contains letters that has to be read.

I opened these books and they both had pages, what a disgusting act of plagiarism

[Stewball]

I opened these books and they both had pages, what a disgusting act of plagiarism

[SirStuckey]

Exactly. "The Hunger Games" is nothing more than a shamelessly plagiarized version of "Battle Royale".

Teens fighting to the death? Check.
On an abandoned island? Check.
Because a futuristic, despotic government forced them to? Check.
With love triangles developing between the students? Check.

I like when my teens fight to the death because they're utopian government asked them nicely.

Also, saying a love triangle developing between characters is plagiarism is far-fetched considering most books with male and female characters have love stories (especially young adult novels).

It may very well be plagiarism, but it's impossible to tell. I wouldn't say that Battle Royale is that popular in America where it's inconceivable that she hasn't heard it. I only read it because of the movie, which I only heard about because I frequent online message boards about movies. The alternate argument could be that she felt she could more easily get away with it because it's a lesser known property (at least in the states).

Many of the ideas in both stories aren't necessarily that original: dystopian societies that force their poor citizens to do terrible things, rebelling against said society, television shows based on watching people die/kill each other (The Long Walk, Death Race, The Running Man). Anyone who has heard of Roman gladiators could come up with a similar idea.

Despite the many similarities I'm willing to give Collins the benefit of the doubt. The lead up to the actual event was much more defined in The Hunger Games (picking tributes, interviews/skills training, dynamics of the different districts, better sense of the government as a whole, Katniss being seen as a symbol). Note: I have not read the manga based on Battle Royale so if any of those things are in that I wouldn't know, also it's been awhile since I've read Battle Royale so I very well may have forgotten a few bits.

I liked both in different ways, and while I enjoyed Battle Royale more overall I was just as sucked into The Hunger Games when I read it.

[Stewball]

It opens in just over a day. I think my high and low expectations have canceled each other out. I haven't read either book or seen BR. I think it's fair to say I've been washed in the blood of equal expectations and will be walking into it born again and bathed in the light of artistic Truth. Ergo, I'll see y'all on the other side. Vernum est Deus. Amen

[ShogunRua]

Exactly. "The Hunger Games" is nothing more than a shamelessly plagiarized version of "Battle Royale".

Teens fighting to the death? Check.
On an abandoned island? Check.
Because a futuristic, despotic government forced them to? Check.
With love triangles developing between the students? Check.

I like when my teens fight to the death because they're utopian government asked them nicely.

Also, saying a love triangle developing between characters is plagiarism is far-fetched considering most books with male and female characters have love stories (especially young adult novels).

By itself, none of those elements constitute plagiarism. Taken together, however, along with the very curious release of the book (just 9 years after the English release of "Battle Royale" and only 5 years after the still more famous film), it's hard to deny.

It may very well be plagiarism, but it's impossible to tell. I wouldn't say that Battle Royale is that popular in America where it's inconceivable that she hasn't heard it. I only read it because of the movie, which I only heard about because I frequent online message boards about movies. The alternate argument could be that she felt she could more easily get away with it because it's a lesser known property (at least in the states).

Yes, the second point is the key one. The last thing you want to do is plagiarize from an iconic book that even your poorly-informed, ignorant teen fans have heard of or read. (Not saying that's her only book audience, just the vast majority of it)

Many of the ideas in both stories aren't necessarily that original: dystopian societies that force their poor citizens to do terrible things, rebelling against said society, television shows based on watching people die/kill each other (The Long Walk, Death Race, The Running Man). Anyone who has heard of Roman gladiators could come up with a similar idea.

You're arguing against something different than what I've been writing.

I never said that "Battle Royale" was wildly original and wasn't inspired (a very different term from plagiarized) by other, earlier novels. But again, if you compare BR to any of the books you mentioned above, there is a considerable difference. I don't even think Stephen King would argue that there aren't huge, fundamental divergences between The Long Walk/The Running Man and BR.

Between BR and The Hunger Games, though? Minimal change. All of the big things are essentially the same.

Despite the many similarities I'm willing to give Collins the benefit of the doubt. The lead up to the actual event was much more defined in The Hunger Games (picking tributes, interviews/skills training, dynamics of the different districts, better sense of the government as a whole, Katniss being seen as a symbol). Note: I have not read the manga based on Battle Royale so if any of those things are in that I wouldn't know, also it's been awhile since I've read Battle Royale so I very well may have forgotten a few bits.

No, the manga doesn't focus on these things, either.

To me, "plagiarism" doesn't mean there are no original ideas in the derivative work. Clearly, there is some original stuff in "The Hunger Games".

In this case, they just took the overarching template, main concept, and major ideas of BR and then added a greater focus on the government and society surrounding the actual games. (With minor alterations to the games themselves)